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Adelantamiento ilegal (Actualización: Caso Cerrado)
(28-11-2012, 23:28)Marmota escribió: De FIA sporting regulations:

38.15 The stewards may use any video or electronic means to assist them in reaching a decision. The stewards may overrule judges of fact. A breach of the provisions of the Code or these Sporting Regulations relating to the starting procedure, may result in the exclusion of the car and driver concerned from the Event.

De FIA annexe H:

2.3. MARSHAL POSTS

2.3.1 Definition
Surveillance of the track and its immediate surroundings is provided by marshal post staff. In their simplest form these posts, adjacent to the track, should provide an adequate stabilised area protected from the competing cars and sheltered from the elements, for the staff and equipment.

2.3.2 Number and location
These are determined for each circuit in accordance with the circuit characteristics and bearing in mind that:
- no section of the road should escape observation;
- each post should be able to communicate by sight with the preceding and the following one, or shall deploy additional staff to establish a supplementary or relay post to fulfil this condition
- the distance between consecutive posts (disregarding supplementary posts) should not exceed 500 m
- each post which is manned by more than two people must be able to communicate verbally with race control;
- each post should be marked with a sign-board bearing a number increasing incrementally from the fi rst post after the starting line and clearly visible from the track, using a clear logical numbering system
- the FIA must be notified of any modification in number or location of the posts.
In order to assist with the application of the rules concerning yellow flags (see Article 2.5.4.1 b), the exact point from which a particular yellow flag or light applies (no overtaking) may be defined by means of a yellow lateral marking on the edge of the track furthest from the racing line and/or a flexible vertical marker (‘‘floppy’’) on the verge. The purpose of such indicators must be explained in the supplementary regulations.

2.3.4 Staff
Each main post shall be placed under the responsibility of a post chief (the observer) and his deputy, both recognised fit for their office after a special examination under ASN control. They should have at their disposal persons who have received basic training in the duties of a marshal post. The post chief or his deputy should maintain verbal communication with race control. At least one of the staff members should be qualified for basic first aid interventions. At the end of an event, the staff is not to leave the post before the course opening car has passed. Marshals should not wear clothing similar in colour to any signalling flag, particularly yellow and red.

2.3.5 Duties
Each post shall:
- signal to drivers to warn them of any danger or difficulty which they may be unable to foresee (see Article 2.4);
- report immediately to race control any incidents which occur within the limits of action of the post and propose the calling into action of emergency services as necessary;
- intervene on track when necessary as described in Article 2.5
- observe whether the race is run fairly from a sporting point of view and report to race control any unsporting or dangerous behaviour, particularly with regard to Appendix L, Chapter IV, “Code of driving conduct on circuits”;
- keep the road clean and clear of obstacles, attempting to remove any spilled oil, unless expressly requested not to (e.g. in F1 Grands Prix), with the aid of an absorbent substance, brooms and shovels. At the end of each on-track activity, the post should continue to control its sector of the road until informed by race control that all competing cars are off the track.

2.4 SIGNALLING

2.4.1 General
In the supervision of the road, the Clerk of the Course (or his deputy) and the marshal posts rely largely on the use of signals to contribute to the drivers’ safety and enforce the regulations. Signals are given in daylight by different coloured flags, which may be supplemented or replaced by lights. Black and white signal boards of similar dimensions to the flags may also be used for certain signals: these should be clearly specified in the Supplementary Regulations of the event
concerned.
At night, the flags may be replaced by lights and reflective panels, but all drivers must be made aware of this at a briefng beforehand. Yellow lights at each post are obligatory for events run at night (see Article 2.10.1).
If more than one means of signalling is used, the Supplementary Regulations of the event must specify which of them is regulatory.
The start should be controlled from a position close to the start line, from which the starter can see the complete grid area between the barriers and which should be visible to all the drivers, in closed or open cars. It should be protected from debris coming from the direction of the grid.

2.4.3 Signal light specifications
Lights may be used to supplement or replace waved red, yellow, green, blue and white flags. When lights are to be used at an event they should be described in the Suppplementary Regulations and the following requirements should be respected:

2.4.3.3 Light operation
- Each flag should be represented by a pair of lights flashing alternately or by a flashing light panel; the blue pit exit signal may be a single flashing light;
- if double waved yellow flags are deemed necessary, these should still be shown;
- red lights should only be operated from race control;
- all other lights may be operated by marshals or from race control;
- if lights are operated locally, each control box should be designed so as to avoid the possibility of accidental operation and should incorporate repeater lights;
- the electrical system should incorporate an automatic uninterruptable power supply;
- as signal lights normally show one signal at a time, the presence of flag marshals remains essential in case of a situation requiring simultaneous signals.

2.4.5 Signals used at marshal posts

2.4.5.1 Marshal flag signals
a) Red flag. This should be shown waved only on instruction from the Clerk of the Course when it becomes necessary to stop a practice session or the race in conformity with Article 2.4.4.1 b) above.
b) Yellow flag. This is a signal of danger and should be shown to drivers in two ways with the following meanings:
- Single waved: Reduce your speed, do not overtake, and be prepared to change direction. There is a hazard beside or partly on the track.
- Double waved: Reduce your speed signifi cantly, do not overtake, and be prepared to change direction or stop. There is a hazard wholly or partly blocking the track and/or marshals working on or beside the track. Yellow flags should normally be shown only at the marshal post immediately preceding the hazard. In some cases, however, the Clerk of the Course may order them to be shown at more than one marshal post preceding an incident. Overtaking is not permitted between the first yellow flag and the green flag displayed after the incident. Yellow flags should not be shown in the pit lane unless there is an incident of which the driver should be made aware.
c) Yellow flag with red stripes. This should be shown motionless to inform drivers that there is a deterioration of grip due to oil or water on the track in the area beyond the flag. This flag should be displayed, for at least (depending on the circumstances) 4 laps unless the surface returns to normal beforehand. It is not, however, necessary for the sector beyond where this fl ag is being shown to show a green flag.
d) Light blue flag. This should normally be waved, as an indication to a driver that he is about to be overtaken. It has different meanings during practice and the race.
At all times:
- A stationary flag should be displayed to a driver leaving the pits if traffic is approaching on the track.
During practice:
- Give way to a faster car which is about to overtake you.
During the race:
The flag should normally be shown to a car about to be lapped and, when shown, the driver concerned must allow the following car to pass at the earliest opportunity.
e) White flag. This flag should be waved and is used to indicate to the driver that there is a much slower vehicle on the sector of track controlled by that fl ag point.
f) Green flag. This should be used to indicate that the track is clear: it should be waved at the marshal post immediately after the incident that necessitated the use of one or more yellow flags. It may also be used, if deemed necessary by the Clerk of the Course, to signal the start of a warm-up lap or the start of a practice session.

2.4.5.2 Marshal light signals
The above-mentioned signals may be effected using lights or light panels as described in Article 2.4.3. If the signal to stop the race is given with a red light or panel, it shall be entirely under the control of the Clerk of the Course.



Pues nada... bla, bla, bla... pero que no consigo encontrar el dichoso 2.5.4.1 hablando de los floppys...

Es que el impresentable ese de Alex García se refiere al 2.4.5.1 y puso el 2.5.4.1 por error o para confundir un poco más.

Si te fijas de los flopis solo habla en el artículo 2.3.2 y sería como una señalización previa de los comisarios de pista para las banderas amarillas luminosas.

Pero el autor del artículo (el susodicho Alex García) lo que hace es extrapolarlo a las banderas verdes pero eso es cosecha de él porque te vas al artículo 2.4.5.1 donde habla de el uso de las banderas verdes no habla nada de flopis por lo que es cosa de ese individuo mezclar para confundir. En el 2.4.5.1 dice sobre las banderas amarillas :

This is a signal of danger and should be shown to drivers
in two ways with the following meanings:
- Single waved: Reduce your speed, do not overtake,
and be prepared to change direction. There is a hazard
beside or partly on the track.
- Double waved: Reduce your speed signifi cantly, do
not overtake, and be prepared to change direction or
stop. There is a hazard wholly or partly blocking the
track and/or marshals working on or beside the track.
Yellow fl ags should normally be shown only at the marshal
post immediately preceding the hazard.
In some cases, however, the Clerk of the Course may
order them to be shown at more than one marshal post
preceding an incident.
Overtaking is not permitted between the fi rst yellow fl ag
and the green fl ag displayed after the incident.
Yellow fl ags should not be shown in the pit lane unless
there is an incident of which the driver should be made
aware.

Dice que la dirección de carrera puede decidir que se muestren por algún comisario anterior al incidente y que el adelantamiento no esta permitido entre la primera bandera amarilla y la bandera verde.

Sobre las banderas verdes en el mismo artículo 2.4.5.1 solo dice:

This should be used to indicate that the track is clear: it should be waved at the marshal post immediately after
the incident that necessitated the use of one or more
yellow fl ags.

Debe ser mostrada por el comisario posterior al incidente que dió origen a las banderas amarillas.

NADA DE FLOPPIS O PREVIAS EN LAS BANDERAS VERDES, SI QUE HABLA DE FLOPPIS O PREVIAS PARA LAS BANDERAS AMARILLAS.

GANAS DE MALMETER DE ESE ALEX GARCIA
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a mi me gustaria pensar que ferrari va a reclamar agotado casi el plazo, no solo con el tema de las banderas amarillas, sino con la bochornosa actuacion en los últimos Gp de toro rosso, las marionetas de Rbull, que yo sepa la FIA prohibe los coches cliente para evitar precisamente lo que está haciendo Red bull con toro rosso, adulterar la competicion, no puede ser lo de Abu dhabi ,lo de austin ,lo de brasil, cuando tu no estas doblado no puedes frenar y echarte a un lado para que pase Vettel, por que estás actuando como coche cliente , aparte las ordenes entre equipos están tambien prohibidas. Pase lo que pase la FIA debería pararale los pies a Red bull con toro rosso, y deberiamos presionar tanto con el tema de las banderas amarillas como la vomitiva actuacion de toro rosso como equipo cliente de red bull.
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Ahora si que si está bien encaminado en los medios british. Para bien o para mal, está en boca de TODOS. Grandes Safetys....
«All I can do is be me, whoever that is.» Bob Dylan
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(29-11-2012, 00:02)CRAZYHORSE549 escribió: a mi me gustaria pensar que ferrari va a reclamar agotado casi el plazo, no solo con el tema de las banderas amarillas, sino con la bochornosa actuacion en los últimos Gp de toro rosso, las marionetas de Rbull, que yo sepa la FIA prohibe los coches cliente para evitar precisamente lo que está haciendo Red bull con toro rosso, adulterar la competicion, no puede ser lo de Abu dhabi ,lo de austin ,lo de brasil, cuando tu no estas doblado no puedes frenar y echarte a un lado para que pase Vettel, por que estás actuando como coche cliente , aparte las ordenes entre equipos están tambien prohibidas. Pase lo que pase la FIA debería pararale los pies a Red bull con toro rosso, y deberiamos presionar tanto con el tema de las banderas amarillas como la vomitiva actuacion de toro rosso como equipo cliente de red bull.

Es que a ver. Hay 24 coches, 6 de ellos no son rival (hrt, marussia, caterham), 3 se apartan (toro rosso, webber), 1 se deja pasar porque le cae bien (schumacher), De un plumazo 10 coches menos, ya casi esta en los puntos. Y luego los de delante, Senna, Perez, Maldonado se chocan entre ellos y se autoeliminan.... No me jodas!!!

Creo que este año lo de Toro Rosso ha sido descarado y es una forma de manipulación del resultado que no se debería permitir. El año pasado a Mr. Qualifying ya le cayó una buena por una chorrada, ese era el aviso de que si es necesario Toro Rosso ayudaria a Vettel.
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(29-11-2012, 00:02)CRAZYHORSE549 escribió: a mi me gustaria pensar que ferrari va a reclamar agotado casi el plazo, no solo con el tema de las banderas amarillas, sino con la bochornosa actuacion en los últimos Gp de toro rosso, las marionetas de Rbull, que yo sepa la FIA prohibe los coches cliente para evitar precisamente lo que está haciendo Red bull con toro rosso, adulterar la competicion, no puede ser lo de Abu dhabi ,lo de austin ,lo de brasil, cuando tu no estas doblado no puedes frenar y echarte a un lado para que pase Vettel, por que estás actuando como coche cliente , aparte las ordenes entre equipos están tambien prohibidas. Pase lo que pase la FIA debería pararale los pies a Red bull con toro rosso, y deberiamos presionar tanto con el tema de las banderas amarillas como la vomitiva actuacion de toro rosso como equipo cliente de red bull.


Actuó muy parecido Alguersuari con Fernando en Singapur a lo que vimos este finde en Brasil con el Vergner, Kaiser y compañia.


Angry
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¿Alguien que sepa del reglamento pa taparle la boca al Alex Garcia?
«All I can do is be me, whoever that is.» Bob Dylan
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Aunque al final de todo esto no se consiga que le den el titulo a Alonso, si que vamos a conseguir algo grande grande grande, vamos a conseguir que todo el mundo sepa que son los mayores tramposos y manipuladores de la historia, y esto la FIA si que no lo va a poder evitar.

Y algo tambien grande va a ser que Red Bull va a saber lo que todo el mundo piensa de ellos.

Os juro por mi hijo que en los entrenos de pretemporada de Montmelo me planto con una bandera bien grande que pondra lo siguiente " Vettel, RedBull y Toro Rosso, TRAMPOSOS"
Mi PS3 está estropeada. Felipe Massa es rápido...
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No... lo dice en el propio Anexo H... que la regulación acerca de las zonas donde se aplican las banderas está explicado en el 2.5.4.1 b, pero luego van y pasan del 2.5.3.1 al 2.6... amosque...

http://www.fia.com/sport/Regulations/f1regs.html


Jennie Gow: “Me cuesta reconocerlo, pero Alonso es el piloto con más talento que han visto mis ojos en una pista".

Jake Humphrey: "La única cosa de la que no estoy seguro es de si Fernando es el mejor piloto del momento o el mejor de la historia".





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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/20531638
Zhurrita
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Parece que la cosa puede ir tomando color... las primeras lineas del blog de Andrew Benson me resultan significativas:

1) Ferrari esta recolectando pruebas y estudiando presentar denuncia. (estarían sobre el asunto)
2) La FIA se NIEGA a confirmar si esta estudiando o no el asunto. (amos, amos)
3) Red Bull no pudo ser localizado. (ya...)
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