28-06-2012, 20:13
(Este mensaje fue modificado por última vez en: 28-06-2012, 20:23 por El abuelo.)
Los renault usan .. renault ( eso han dicho ellos)
http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2012/06/28...-failures/
Rob White the RenaultSport F1 Deputy Managing Director, provided a detailed explanation of the problem.
Firstly, a point I need to stress, is that the failed alternator is a Renault part
As White explains “it is a Renault part. We use various suppliers for the sub-internals but we build the alternators so we are responsible for the integrity of the part.” W
hite continues and confirms the cause of the failures “It appears that both alternators overheated. We’ve checked over the parts thoroughly now and it seems that there were no obvious reasons for the failure, so we are conducting further tests on the dyno at Viry to replicate conditions and double checking the findings”.
As the failure on Vettel’s Red Bull occurred immediately after the safety car came in, it was a common assumption that the Safety car caused the failure some how. “The slower speeds prolonged its life expectancy slightly” was the surprise response from White, as the slow running meant the alternator was running at a reduced load and allowed it to cool.
White goes on to explain the failure was already a known problem for Red Bull in the race
“We had evidence that the alternator on Sebastian’s car was showing signs of overheating before the safety car period. Of course, when Sebastian went back up to racing speed, the problem stepped up again and the result is now well known”.
In contrast to the forewarning of the Red Bull failure, the Lotus problem came on more quickly “With Romain’s, the problem occurred very suddenly some laps after the safety car had been withdrawn.”
This years Renault alternator is a slightly revised specification and the units on the two cars in Valencia were effectively ‘new’, as both drivers had a fresh engine installed after Friday. This perhaps points to an explanation for these specific failures “they were brand new parts, which points to the fact that this may be an issue with a particular batch of alternators”.
With two high profile failures and each which could have cost a race victory, RenaultSport, have to act to resolve the issue on behalf of their customers. With the British GP just a week away and within the stringent engine regulations, their options are limited. With it being a clear reliability issue and potentially restricted to batch of Alternators, White proposes several options “The first is to use another batch of alternators for Silverstone across all our clients, or a slightly modified design.” The next option White suggests is “looking at returning to an older specification of alternator from 2011.”
As well as the physical alternator, there are other ways the teams manage the problem “potentially introduce some mechanical and cooling solutions, or changing a few settings on acceleration maps so the running is less severe.”
White concludes “All of these will be in evaluated between now and Silverstone, plus we will also look at everything after Friday running and see what additional measures we may need to take.”
Un alternador que trabaje a 18.000 revoluciones, se calentará mucho mas que uno que trabaje 5000.
Eso solo como ejemplo.
No hablamos de motores refrigerados por aire.. para los que sí pueden ser dañinos un SC..
El problema es que Vettel y Grosjean pusieron motor nuevo el sabado, y con ellos, venían alternadores de un 'nuevo paquete'.
Ese 'nuevo paquete' ha fallado por sobre calentamiento.
Y las soluciones que les da Renault a sus clientes son:
-.Usar otros alternadores del mismo diseño (para eliminar problemas de fabricación.. )
-.Usar alternadores de diferente diseño (para eliminar un fallo de diseño)
-.Usar alternadores del 2011, de diferente diseño/fabricación ( para evitar los dos problemas)
Así mismo, y para paliar cualquier problema :
As well as the physical alternator, there are other ways the teams manage the problem “potentially introduce some mechanical and cooling solutions, or changing a few settings on acceleration maps so the running is less severe.”
- Introducir soluciones mecanicas y de refrigeración..
- o cambiar unos pocos ajustes en los mapas para que el trabajo del alternador sea menos severo
Se trata ( por lo que leo entre lineas) de un mensajito de Renault 'motores' a sus clientes:
"Si quereis usar esos mapas motor, preparad mas refrigeración.. o yo no me hago responsable, ni con modelos nuevos"
http://scarbsf1.wordpress.com/2012/06/28...-failures/
Rob White the RenaultSport F1 Deputy Managing Director, provided a detailed explanation of the problem.
Firstly, a point I need to stress, is that the failed alternator is a Renault part
As White explains “it is a Renault part. We use various suppliers for the sub-internals but we build the alternators so we are responsible for the integrity of the part.” W
hite continues and confirms the cause of the failures “It appears that both alternators overheated. We’ve checked over the parts thoroughly now and it seems that there were no obvious reasons for the failure, so we are conducting further tests on the dyno at Viry to replicate conditions and double checking the findings”.
As the failure on Vettel’s Red Bull occurred immediately after the safety car came in, it was a common assumption that the Safety car caused the failure some how. “The slower speeds prolonged its life expectancy slightly” was the surprise response from White, as the slow running meant the alternator was running at a reduced load and allowed it to cool.
White goes on to explain the failure was already a known problem for Red Bull in the race
“We had evidence that the alternator on Sebastian’s car was showing signs of overheating before the safety car period. Of course, when Sebastian went back up to racing speed, the problem stepped up again and the result is now well known”.
In contrast to the forewarning of the Red Bull failure, the Lotus problem came on more quickly “With Romain’s, the problem occurred very suddenly some laps after the safety car had been withdrawn.”
This years Renault alternator is a slightly revised specification and the units on the two cars in Valencia were effectively ‘new’, as both drivers had a fresh engine installed after Friday. This perhaps points to an explanation for these specific failures “they were brand new parts, which points to the fact that this may be an issue with a particular batch of alternators”.
With two high profile failures and each which could have cost a race victory, RenaultSport, have to act to resolve the issue on behalf of their customers. With the British GP just a week away and within the stringent engine regulations, their options are limited. With it being a clear reliability issue and potentially restricted to batch of Alternators, White proposes several options “The first is to use another batch of alternators for Silverstone across all our clients, or a slightly modified design.” The next option White suggests is “looking at returning to an older specification of alternator from 2011.”
As well as the physical alternator, there are other ways the teams manage the problem “potentially introduce some mechanical and cooling solutions, or changing a few settings on acceleration maps so the running is less severe.”
White concludes “All of these will be in evaluated between now and Silverstone, plus we will also look at everything after Friday running and see what additional measures we may need to take.”
Un alternador que trabaje a 18.000 revoluciones, se calentará mucho mas que uno que trabaje 5000.
Eso solo como ejemplo.
No hablamos de motores refrigerados por aire.. para los que sí pueden ser dañinos un SC..
El problema es que Vettel y Grosjean pusieron motor nuevo el sabado, y con ellos, venían alternadores de un 'nuevo paquete'.
Ese 'nuevo paquete' ha fallado por sobre calentamiento.
Y las soluciones que les da Renault a sus clientes son:
-.Usar otros alternadores del mismo diseño (para eliminar problemas de fabricación.. )
-.Usar alternadores de diferente diseño (para eliminar un fallo de diseño)
-.Usar alternadores del 2011, de diferente diseño/fabricación ( para evitar los dos problemas)
Así mismo, y para paliar cualquier problema :
As well as the physical alternator, there are other ways the teams manage the problem “potentially introduce some mechanical and cooling solutions, or changing a few settings on acceleration maps so the running is less severe.”
- Introducir soluciones mecanicas y de refrigeración..
- o cambiar unos pocos ajustes en los mapas para que el trabajo del alternador sea menos severo
Se trata ( por lo que leo entre lineas) de un mensajito de Renault 'motores' a sus clientes:
"Si quereis usar esos mapas motor, preparad mas refrigeración.. o yo no me hago responsable, ni con modelos nuevos"
¿Tres campeonatos?
El problema es que entonces querré conseguir otro, y otro y otro... La ambición es imparable, infinita.
Fernando Alonso
El problema es que entonces querré conseguir otro, y otro y otro... La ambición es imparable, infinita.
Fernando Alonso